Hi folks.
This change came as a surprise to most of us, and greatly affects gameplay. Anecdotally, everyone I have spoken to OTHER than luna hates that ghost has been taken away from indoor maps. Myself included. I would "vote" for it to be re-instated.
Most players have been around for a long time, and HATE losing. When bases can easily be infiltrated by heavy's/chems/builder, players get mad, drop, and the game dies out quickly. Necro/ghost is a good trade-off of allowing base defense to be breached, yet the armour is fairly weak, so you generally can't wreak complete havoc once inside. A few flame turrets properly placed usually sorts them out. So its a good trade-off.
I know Luna thinks its cheating to have an inventory/air base outside an indoor map. But its level playing field. Anyone can do it. Luna often accuses people of cheating... I'm not sure that should be the basis for such large changes to the mod.
Lastly (for now), there are indoor maps in rotation that have little "gems" that were clearly intituted to be utilized by ghost. Plasmatic's Roach Motel comes to mind, but there are others. Happy to discuss further.
Mod Updates
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LunaticChick
- Posts: 428
- Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2011 6:13 pm
Re: Mod Updates
Game on ...
First of all, you have not spoken to me about this change, so stop with the bs lies. I'm sure you have ss of me accusing others of cheating, post them. PROVE to me that some ppls don't cheat and using the "1.41 doesn't allow it" is bs also, as far as I am concerned. We have enough coders that can manipulate code to their liking and for others. Just like all the smurfs that play and have blocked admins from seeing all their names. We see new names/ppls all the time and we all know they aren't "new" ppls, don't we. And what about using versions that are not 1.41? That doesn't seem to bother some even though they have a distinct advantage. Nobody getting on that bandwagon. Maybe that's next?
Why should we have maps that you HAVE to use the ghost pack to cap the flag as mentioned previously by some of you. Seems unfair to me but those who don't care about fair are complaining. Why should one pack potentially sway the outcome the game. And if it's true about the little "gems" that were built into maps ... guess they were placed there for some ppls advantage not for fair game play. And you think the ghost/necro armor is weak? What a load of crap that is. I'm surprised it took so long before one of the trolls to complain.
I make a suggestion that I think will help with closed maps and I am vilified by a verbal abuser and a misogynist. Verbal abuse in the servers has become an expected and accepted behavior by some. Just like with the abuse TP experienced by an "adult". Who spoke up for TP? Me. What does that say about those who did nothing to stop it? Or in fact, who do nothing now to stop it. I've been told by one of our owners that I should just "accept" the verbal abuse, "it's part of the game". I won't accept it, period.
You don't know shit about me. Stop acting like you do. I suggested an idea and you take it personally and attack me in the forums. I think you need a diaper change.
First of all, you have not spoken to me about this change, so stop with the bs lies. I'm sure you have ss of me accusing others of cheating, post them. PROVE to me that some ppls don't cheat and using the "1.41 doesn't allow it" is bs also, as far as I am concerned. We have enough coders that can manipulate code to their liking and for others. Just like all the smurfs that play and have blocked admins from seeing all their names. We see new names/ppls all the time and we all know they aren't "new" ppls, don't we. And what about using versions that are not 1.41? That doesn't seem to bother some even though they have a distinct advantage. Nobody getting on that bandwagon. Maybe that's next?
Why should we have maps that you HAVE to use the ghost pack to cap the flag as mentioned previously by some of you. Seems unfair to me but those who don't care about fair are complaining. Why should one pack potentially sway the outcome the game. And if it's true about the little "gems" that were built into maps ... guess they were placed there for some ppls advantage not for fair game play. And you think the ghost/necro armor is weak? What a load of crap that is. I'm surprised it took so long before one of the trolls to complain.
I make a suggestion that I think will help with closed maps and I am vilified by a verbal abuser and a misogynist. Verbal abuse in the servers has become an expected and accepted behavior by some. Just like with the abuse TP experienced by an "adult". Who spoke up for TP? Me. What does that say about those who did nothing to stop it? Or in fact, who do nothing now to stop it. I've been told by one of our owners that I should just "accept" the verbal abuse, "it's part of the game". I won't accept it, period.
You don't know shit about me. Stop acting like you do. I suggested an idea and you take it personally and attack me in the forums. I think you need a diaper change.
Re: Mod Updates
I haven't gotten around to it yet, but I think a good solution would be to have disabling Ghost Pack on Indoor maps as an option to vote to enable, but off by default when the server starts up.
The general philosophy has always been to add things to the mod without changing or taking away too much of what it already was and having a pack disabled by default on a map type feels like it goes against that.
The general philosophy has always been to add things to the mod without changing or taking away too much of what it already was and having a pack disabled by default on a map type feels like it goes against that.
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Synsilliusarian
- Posts: 26
- Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2016 8:05 pm
Re: Mod Updates
Hello all,
I hope everybody had a great Thanksgiving.
I don't see any reason for fingerpointing.
I think the suggestion to end ghost pack indoors was a good one, simply because it gave us a taste of what the mod is without it. A live test, if you will. I also think, through my own experience, that it should be enabled for indoor maps. As a few others have said, there are certain maps that are just *impossible* without it. Box, I think, is the most notorious. The only way to get the flag on Box, if there is defense set, is to use the "Deployable pad trick." Basically a builder would place a deployable pad, and pitchfork it into position to block the turrets above. However, this only works if there is no offense on the opposing team. It is practically impossible to do this when there is a steady flow of offense coming down the flag tunnel. The only possibilities to get the flag are results of 1) teams being unfairly stacked 2) there is no defense set, or anyone to maintain said defense, 3) there is no offense, and 4) there are only a few players actually playing the map and not sitting in Obs. This last one ties into #3, and in some instances #1 as well.
On other maps, once defense is set, especially when it's set by an experienced defender that knows how to counter the ghost pack, and knows how to maintain his/her defense, it can take the entire map time to clear, before being able to get to the flag. Some times it is just easier to clear the flag itself of ghost-countering objects, and then move in with the necromancer/ghost pack.
I like the idea of having a voting option to disable/enable ghost pack indoors. Though I think it would hardly be used, it would still be nice to have the option. It would be far too work-intensive to attempt any redesigns//fixes for ghost-pack on already-existing indoor maps. However, I have made an indoor map, that I have yet to submit, that was made with ghost-pack in mind. I have designed it in such a way to allow the use of ghost-pack, while countering any (as far as I can tell through my own testing) so-called 'abuse' of the pack. I intend to do this with any future indoor maps I make, and I encourage anyone else who decides to make an indoor map, to design it this way to the best of your ability.
I hope everybody had a great Thanksgiving.
I don't see any reason for fingerpointing.
I think the suggestion to end ghost pack indoors was a good one, simply because it gave us a taste of what the mod is without it. A live test, if you will. I also think, through my own experience, that it should be enabled for indoor maps. As a few others have said, there are certain maps that are just *impossible* without it. Box, I think, is the most notorious. The only way to get the flag on Box, if there is defense set, is to use the "Deployable pad trick." Basically a builder would place a deployable pad, and pitchfork it into position to block the turrets above. However, this only works if there is no offense on the opposing team. It is practically impossible to do this when there is a steady flow of offense coming down the flag tunnel. The only possibilities to get the flag are results of 1) teams being unfairly stacked 2) there is no defense set, or anyone to maintain said defense, 3) there is no offense, and 4) there are only a few players actually playing the map and not sitting in Obs. This last one ties into #3, and in some instances #1 as well.
On other maps, once defense is set, especially when it's set by an experienced defender that knows how to counter the ghost pack, and knows how to maintain his/her defense, it can take the entire map time to clear, before being able to get to the flag. Some times it is just easier to clear the flag itself of ghost-countering objects, and then move in with the necromancer/ghost pack.
I like the idea of having a voting option to disable/enable ghost pack indoors. Though I think it would hardly be used, it would still be nice to have the option. It would be far too work-intensive to attempt any redesigns//fixes for ghost-pack on already-existing indoor maps. However, I have made an indoor map, that I have yet to submit, that was made with ghost-pack in mind. I have designed it in such a way to allow the use of ghost-pack, while countering any (as far as I can tell through my own testing) so-called 'abuse' of the pack. I intend to do this with any future indoor maps I make, and I encourage anyone else who decides to make an indoor map, to design it this way to the best of your ability.
Re: Mod Updates
No it won't.
You can use phase shifter to sneak through walls and ceilings, too. Ghost pack is a quicker way to penetrate walls in most circumstances, but only phase shifter can penetrate walls, floors, ceilings, and terrain, so disabling ghost pack won't stop people like me from being sneaky snakes. In fact, disabling ghost pack will make it even more surprising when a player does sneak around your booby traps, and you'll have let your guard down because you weren't expecting it.
Regarding the question of morality/rules, I'd say that is merely an opinion. I've designed many maps before and after the invention of ghost armor with the knowledge that players could sneak into unexpected places. Most of my maps have hidden loot or traps in such locations depending on whether I wanted players to be able to go there. I don't really see it as a moral issue at all. I've hidden Easter eggs in my maps and it delights me when people find them.
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Synsilliusarian
- Posts: 26
- Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2016 8:05 pm
Re: Mod Updates
Upside Down is the first one that comes to mind.
Some iterations of Labyrinth had loot. Some had traps. Some had both.
I forget what I named it, but there was one map with 4 teams. Chameleon pack doesn't work when there are more than 2 teams because the creator of chameleon pack was lazy, so I added my own version of chameleon pack to the map. The stealth mode thingy is easy to find, but there are other annihilation mod inspired easter eggs in that map that work regardless of which armor you're wearing or which mod the server is hosting.
I don't think I've ever uploaded a map that didn't have some scripted feature.
Re: Mod Updates
Gotta say as someone who used to play Tribes and this mod a lot these changes are a turn off.
Nerfing ghost and airbase, why?
The damage on bouncing off level boundaries, why?
The 15 min afk timer, why?
These restrictions would make sense if Tribes was a new game and the server was getting hundreds of players a day. You would want to keep the gameplay focused and keep afk players out. You don't get many players these days. One of the fun things about anni compared to base is how much you used to be able to experiment with stuff on the server.
Building airbases underground was FUN. Finding out how to do it, how to get to it, how to mitigate the out of bounds damage, etc. Bouncing back and forth seeing how fast you can zoom across the map was FUN. Going afk isn't fun but it attracts players to the server, people join servers that have players on them. The joiners also pull people out of afk. The armors as they used to be were FUN because you could do a lot with them, mess around when bored, and there were counters to them.
Trying to nerf, child proof, the server has made it worse.
Heavies that used to spawn camp with no shield cooldown used to piss me off but I'd find a way to beat them. The invis beacon used to be annoying too but I'd find a way to shoot them down. The ghost pack was annoying but there were ways to deal with it.
The only real problem the mod used to have was base raping and not allowing the enemy team to respawn. That would cause people to rage quit but it's easily dealt with. Spawn protection, generator protection or regen.
Kinda wanted to get into Tribes again and maybe this mod if the only one people play but the changes are meh.
Some stuff was annoying but it forced you to find ways to deal with it and up your game.
Nerfing ghost and airbase, why?
The damage on bouncing off level boundaries, why?
The 15 min afk timer, why?
These restrictions would make sense if Tribes was a new game and the server was getting hundreds of players a day. You would want to keep the gameplay focused and keep afk players out. You don't get many players these days. One of the fun things about anni compared to base is how much you used to be able to experiment with stuff on the server.
Building airbases underground was FUN. Finding out how to do it, how to get to it, how to mitigate the out of bounds damage, etc. Bouncing back and forth seeing how fast you can zoom across the map was FUN. Going afk isn't fun but it attracts players to the server, people join servers that have players on them. The joiners also pull people out of afk. The armors as they used to be were FUN because you could do a lot with them, mess around when bored, and there were counters to them.
Trying to nerf, child proof, the server has made it worse.
Heavies that used to spawn camp with no shield cooldown used to piss me off but I'd find a way to beat them. The invis beacon used to be annoying too but I'd find a way to shoot them down. The ghost pack was annoying but there were ways to deal with it.
The only real problem the mod used to have was base raping and not allowing the enemy team to respawn. That would cause people to rage quit but it's easily dealt with. Spawn protection, generator protection or regen.
Kinda wanted to get into Tribes again and maybe this mod if the only one people play but the changes are meh.
Some stuff was annoying but it forced you to find ways to deal with it and up your game.
Re: Mod Updates
I think the big problem right now is the variety of options available on this one server versus the dwindling population in the game.
I haven't played in a long time because every time I try, nobody is playing CTF.
They are either of building shit somewhere random or fucking around in the arena.
Back in my day, we had to walk uphill both ways in the snow and vote to change the mission if we didn't want to play the current one. And that vote usually lost, so you'd just be forced to whoop ass and achieve the mission objectives of you wanted it to change.
I haven't played in a long time because every time I try, nobody is playing CTF.
They are either of building shit somewhere random or fucking around in the arena.
Back in my day, we had to walk uphill both ways in the snow and vote to change the mission if we didn't want to play the current one. And that vote usually lost, so you'd just be forced to whoop ass and achieve the mission objectives of you wanted it to change.